Safety at meets

[Locky]

I've been talking to several people about this today, namely Becky, Q, Sprog, Naz and Stevie. Basically a gym meet over the weekend has raised some concerns about our own safety at meets, and this includes outdoor meets as well. As the person doing most of the organising for Capital Bocking this year, I feel it is absolutely critical we get this sorted.

I wasn't present at the meet and so the only information I have is that people attempted flips and got injured. The example I want to use is Janelle because I care for her a great deal and the result is possibly threatening her doing the Walk for life, which is very important for her.
Now I'm not going to emphasize on joe's (soul rancher) accident so much because joe is at the stage where he knows the risks. He can already backflip and has overcome many of the mental barriers needed for such things. In hindsight, someone should have been there with a mat to slide under him if something went wrong but as I said, joe knows the risks more than others do. Even so, Joe was inches away from permanent paralysis.

From what I can tell, the meet this past weekend was attended by members from several groups and had a lot of fun, but I think the excitement clouded the safety responsibilities.

I really hope jelly doesnt take this in offence but as someone who is responsible for others at gym meets, I absolutely would not allow anyone to attempt a flip onto thin gym mats until they are landing them 80+% of the time on the crash mat. Maybe jelly is at this stage but I am not aware of her landing any flips.
Injuries do happen in this sport but I think it is crucial we get together a list or document of "Best Practices for meet ups" together asap. This is something we would have put together as an ongoing project for the national association but with meets happening all the time now, and the good weather here already, it clearly needs addressing now.

The last thing I want is for this to cause any bad air between anyone. I dont know who organised the meet on the weekend, if there was any ground crew or if anyone was overseeing safety etc but this really isnt about one meet that ended in a few injuries. It's about all of us and making sure we avoid such injuries as much as possible.
This is important not only for our lives and bodies but also for our sport.
It can take only one accident for a hall manager to kick us out. One article of bad press that could cause ongoing problems for us all.

We need to get this right and we need to do it now.

[hemoves.com]

I think you have a great point in this mail. Its good that the question is now out there

[stevie]

Locky You'v just about said it all there, and we all wish Jelly and Soul Rancher a speedy recovery,

Locky, it may be an idea to post a list of checks for meets, like the use of sliding slip matts you mentioned, and the role of ground crew,there are many more, it could be that not all people know the techneque that we use,but if it was made in simple and in easy steps with no short cuts it may be an answer for the short term that could be a help for others, and groups that are just starting up i think they would realy respect such a list,

 i hope that none of your or my coments are taken the wrong way by anyone, if so i am sorry and i apologise,and nobody has the right to tell another what they should or not do, its just that you can't teach someone experience, but you can share it, and like you said, its for there own protection and the good of the sport.

[Sprog]

I think this meet highlighted a lot of issues that we haven't really taken notice of recently.
Like Matt said, I have never seen or heard of Jelly landing a flip so she should not have been allowed to do them on gymnastic mats. Joe should not have gone for that double back onto hard ground until he is landing 9 out of 10 of them onto crash mats.
People need to stop running and slow back down to walking, taking it at a gradual pace. Yes people are advancing faster now amd I think that pushing each other is good, but it should be done sensibly, rather than going for things like this.
If you're going to be attempting new tricks I think from now on you should have a spotter and someone ready to slide a crash mat underneath you.
I know when we do things at the JJ meets we do silly things and have a laugh but I feel a lot of that is from the trust we have gained from knowing eachother for well over a year and knowing our own and friends limits, and we know what is safe to do and what isn't. I think partially we may be to blame for this as a lot of our gym videos have a bit of stupidity and fun in, but we know what we're doing and what is and isn't safe for each individual member to attempt. We know Colin feels ill after flipping so he doesn't do flips, I know I don't feel confident jumping things so I will only do what I feel safe with, if people try to push us we will say no and stay where we know we won't get injured.

Basically PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE progress at a slower rate, for your own and other people's safety, and only do things you are 100% confident on.

I am not saying anything was at all the fault of the club organising this meet or the gym owners, but the fact everyone got caught up in the moment and forgot what is safe and what isn't.

[dominion]

This couldn't have come at a better time, as these are all things that i've been discussing heavily with Nick (Xarnusonci)

We need to get on the same page with safety, because we are all ambassadors to this sport and activity.

Coming up with a set of standardized rules and ways to keep ourselves and bystanders out of hot water is a very good thing to have as a mantra.

For the most part, it should be common sense ingrained into each of us, but we should also rely on our fellow bockers to set us straight when we step out of line.

For the most part, we all know and accept the risks that we take.

In terms of rules or guidelines....

Everyone should at the very minimum wear kneepads and gloves.
Armguards and or elbow pads when running or attempting new tricks where there is a high likelyhood of falling...
and helmets when we go topsy turvy on non gym surfaces. (IE: Outdoors)

It's not only good safety advice in general, but will also promote good press for ourselves as RESPONSIBLE users of a new technology, but will also set precedent by example.  The more exposure we have with wearing safety equipment VOLUNTARILY, the more people will see and understand that there is a clear and present risk at hand. 

I also think we should compile a list of equipment we currently use and brands that we support.

I currently have reccomendations, and may possibly be able to get discount codes and even become and intermediary for a company Like 661 who makes top grade safety gear.  If we group buy saftey gear, we will save money and minimize long term injuries which could cost far more than a little bit of safety gear ever would or could.

With that said... I know some of you feel very strongly about not wearing it, as I have in the past as well.  I don't "want" to wear it anymore than the rest of you, but I also do not "want" bocking banned from bad press or otherwise, or I also do not "want" to lose all the skin on my arms or break a bone, or even worse... my skull.  What we currently have going on, is a great thing... and for one or two of us to ruin that, would be a major set back in terms of acceptance from the community and the press.

I also think that possibly requiring at the very minimum gloves and knee pads to a meet, as MANDATORY would go a long way.  Anyone that isn't wearing these things should be asked to leave.

[stevie]

Sprog, you guys are well respected for both your skill and fun meets, i'v met most of you and Reon is a big fan of Soul Rancher, and can't wait to meet him, and i agrea with your advice to progres at a safe pace. accidents happen in every sport, look at us lot lol, i too get carried away, i think its new people that will look to you more advanced bockers for rights and wrongs, hope to see you soon mate.

[bmthbloke]

As Matt mentioned I had a chat earlier ., id like to say it was with the the view to comming up with , we agreed,  akind of code to best pratices for , particularly gym meets. Its said its good to learn by ones own mistakes. But I have to say its alot less painfull to learn by others.

. Now I ll put hand up and say the JJ's themselves ( well me) have had to drive 1 person to A&E and the result was an operation on the knee. Becky too you will recall broke her leg in a gym accident , so these things happen , but must be looked at to see if preventable --and then the imfomation disseminated as best as possible.

Ill admit I sell the idea of the gym  as ' asafe place to learn'. But to day I got to thinking. Is it?  Because  the safty of the matts and stuff just makes us do more dangerous things!.

But enuff waffling, Ill give you the JJ's ONLY rules, they all relate to the gym and are the bare basics to be built apon.

a/ Always wear elbow, knee, wrist pads
b/Bring plenty and take plenty of liquids throughout a meet
c/ take a break whenever you want one.

To add, Ill use the phrase every meet must have 'responsible adult'. This doesnt need to be the best bocker or the person who does the most teaching ( if there is any) but often is the latter. But its he person the buck stops with. who must make sure , as far as possible, the safest and best practises are followed and throughout a meet. Its not a case of giving a lecture setting up the kit and 'go away and play'. It goes on throughout  a meet.

The work the job requires varies. Sometimes its nothing, if an experienced coach takes over for a lesson or as in the last JJ meet only 4 'old slags' turned up and as a vid should soon show a very silly time was had. But at the 1st meet after christmas 5 total noobs turned up. So that ment total concentration on them for the entire 2 hours.

Becky admitted earlier that she thinks oneof thereasons she broke her leg was due to a crash mat slipping. This is a prime example of 'learning by OTHER peoples mistakes'. In the JJ's we just take it for granted toavoid this we put two crash mats end on end and then buttress one against the wall . I think its become so natural that we forget why we do it. Indeed I suspect some of the noobs who turn up early and push the mats to these spots --dont even know why just put them there becuase thats where they always go.

Im interested in Stevie's idea of pushing a matt under a flipper. I know of it from tramp' work but didnt know of it in our shpere. Any chance of a quick vid of that from some1? Save me trying to work it out myself?

Ok enuff from me at mo 

[janelle]

I totally agree to what everyone has said here on this thread. I am not experienced at somersaults and realise the dangers that are involved with doing so. I know that there should have been someone to spot me as im inexperienced and can not yet land somi's. I also know that because i can not land them that there should have been more than just 1 crash mat, which is where my problem arose.
Soul rancher (joe) had been using the crash mat before i attempted my somersault and because he has more experience, he didnt need the extra mat. I didnt realise my mistake until i had my accident, i didnt realise there was just 1 mat there because i was caught up in the moment, if i had realised i wouldnt have taken the leap of faith. I know that 2 mats would have been safer for me at my level and would only ever attempt it with 2 mats and no less.
It was a mistake on my part for not taking notice but i think that it could have been dealt with and organisined a lot better. Not blaming anyone for what happened to me, as i know for a fact that the same thing happened to muncher and blaze when we went to another gym meet a couple of months back, but luckily their injuries were'nt as bad as mine, grrrr.
We should definitely outline some ground rules and regulations for all bockers, so similar things like this dont happen again and that the health and safety of the bocking community is looked after and that we can gain respect from the outside world and be recognised as a fun, exciting sport and not a dangerous one that is to be avoided.

jelly x

[Kiola]

so whats happened to Joe. .can someone clarify?!

[Locky]

I thought you went?

He was trying a back2back but basically failed to bounce on the second one, and went backwards and landed square on his shoulders. The video looked nasty and really shows how lucky he was to escape with minor injuries. I believe the video has been taken down now.
He's ok but it does highlight the areas people are missing in these "safe zones".

[stevie]

Q, sorry i don;'t have any footage but i'm in the gym on thursday, so i'l film  it with the crash mat thing, unles Locky or Kiola has any footage of it, it won't stop a bail, but it will help to make a softer landing,

and Q, i agrea with you about feeling safer in the gym so one may let down thier guard etc.

[Bill C.]

As important as safety equipment, maybe more important, is respecting your own limits. That is not to say don't push yourself - but only push yourself when all safety measures have been put into place.  By respecting your limits (and those of others), I mean even the simplest of things.  For example, the last time I went bocking at Jones Beach, Dominion and his sister suggested we bock off the boardwalk and across the sand for about 100 meters to the ocean's edge.  I realized that this side trip would totally fatigue my knees and leg muscles and as a result would then make me more prone to twisted knee injury when bocking afterwards -- so I felt I had to decline.  I was willing to just wait on the boardwalk for them, but Dominion and his sis were kind enough to alter their plans and accommodate my limitation.

[Muncher]

yep i agree with the thread... I have to say that i was frustrated that janelle was injured, mainly because blaze and i did the same thing at beckys gym meet a few weeks earlier... there were two mats but we went over them and there was only one mat behind it.. i was winded and had pins and needles down the backs of my legs... and so did josh.. i would like awareness about inexperience to be raised and all people to be a bit more careful.. you only get one back, and it would be a shame to lose it to a dirty gym floor... many thanks to tok for looking after jelly baby for me... I owe ya big init!

[martin]

@Locky
Thanks for starting this important topic/ discussion. We should not wait for serious injuries to understand our own limits (skills) and the risks of bocking (which exist, like in any sport).

safety first

One thing to think about: It was sometimes laughed at me since I wore my helmet often during meets (outdoor and indoor). I wore it even when I did no difficult stuff. Once I ran down a hill and fell at full speed with a twist on the back of my head on hard asphalt. The helmet saved my life (as stupid as it may sound).

[Dark Knight]

@Locky
Thanks for starting this important topic/ discussion. We should not wait for serious injuries to understand our own limits (skills) and the risks of bocking (which exist, like in any sport).

safety first

One thing to think about: It was sometimes laughed at me since I wore my helmet often during meets (outdoor and indoor). I wore it even when I did no difficult stuff. Once I ran down a hill and fell at full speed with a twist on the back of my head on hard asphalt. The helmet saved my life (as stupid as it may sound).

The first rule in a gym or anywhere for that matter is.

Never take the P's out of peoples safety equipment.  If they wish to use it they shouldn't be made to feel stupid it's thier choice for safety.